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Soundcloud -- BEWARE

I don’t use SC anymore, but when I did, tracks were ripped off in the US, and used on network radio. I had no money to sue them, so, oh well.
That doesn't sound like the truth, if they were really ripped off you could easily sue them or otherwise make copyright claims against them and wouldn't lose any money. The only way you would be unable to do anything would be if you couldn't prove they were yours. Well that was your choice not to do anything but there's a lot of action you could have took in the USA. In China there's not only nothing you can do but they even effectively have laws to protect the thieves if anything. But either way, watermarks will prevent anyone from stealing your music so easily.
 
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That doesn't sound like the truth, if they were really ripped off you could easily sue them or otherwise make copyright claims against them and wouldn't lose any money. The only way you would be unable to do anything would be if you couldn't prove they were yours. Well that was your choice not to do anything but there's a lot of action you could have took in the USA. In China there's not only nothing you can do but they even effectively have laws to protect the thieves if anything. But either way, watermarks will prevent anyone from stealing your music so easily.
Oh, it’s the truth, Hasen6. You must not be an American. Ever tried to sue a huge US corporation for using one song on a network radio talk show? How would you do that it a way that didn’t cost money?

There was a further problem: what was scraped and used on the air was an early version of a track I later signed to a publishing deal - the old version had already been ripped and then detected later, before I signed it and scrubbed SC. I told the publisher about it and a.) they forgave me, luckily, and b.) they were smart enough to not waste money suing.

As for the other part... Emergent, developing countries always steal IP. The US certainly did. Wherever you’re from did too at some point. C’est la vie
 
The point of my original post is that the agreement is written in a way that easily could lead to confusion -- bad confusion -- that could cause misunderstandings and disputes.
Kind regards,

John
John, sorry to say, but thats exactly what your post is doing that started this thread. You chose to only show the first paragraph to scare the readers and left out the rest of the paragraph that delimits the actual ways in which these usages are permitted by Soundcloud.
You only posted half the truth from Soundcloud and you should really edit your post and add in the missing part to stop the confusion you are creating.

I recommend everyone to read bbumkers excellent posts in this thread quoted below (he has posted several good posts) that gives a fuller story.
I'm no lawyer, but the rest of the paragraph delimits the actual ways in which these usages are permitted. Here is the remainder of the pertinent section: (Note that the paragraph does not actually conclude here - the rest of it limits the use of trade and service marks by end users...)

"By uploading Your Content to the Platform, you also grant a limited, worldwide, non-exclusive, royalty-free, fully paid up, license to other users of the Platform, and to operators and users of any other websites, apps and/or platforms to which Your Content has been shared or embedded using the Services (“Linked Services”), to use, copy, listen to offline, repost, transmit or otherwise distribute, publicly display, publicly perform, adapt, prepare derivative works of, compile, make available and otherwise communicate to the public, Your Content utilizing the features of the Platform from time to time, and within the parameters set by you using the Services. You can limit and restrict the availability of certain of Your Content to other users of the Platform, and to users of Linked Services, at any time using the permissions tab in the track edit section for each sound you upload, subject to the provisions of the Disclaimer section below."

(Bold in the second half of the paragraph added by me)

There are in effect three sections to this paragraph - the first, which lists the license which is being granted and to whom, second, the things which one can do with that license (i.e., use, copy, etc.), and the third, which begins with "Your content utilizing" which limits the application of that license to the parameters that you as content provider have set, and that these activities must exist within the context of 'utilizing the features of the Platform." Unless these film makers are using exclusively Soundcloud to make films, then there is absolutely zero license granted to steal anything from that paragraph in full.

There is also this paragraph which concludes the section on the Grant of License which precludes the uses being discussed in this thread outside of the platform:

"Any Content other than Your Content is the property of the relevant Uploader, and is or may be subject to copyright, trademark rights or other intellectual property or proprietary rights. Such Content may not be downloaded, reproduced, distributed, transmitted, re-uploaded, republished, displayed, sold, licensed, made available or otherwise communicated to the public or exploited for any purposes except via the features of the Platform from time to time and within the parameters set by the Uploader on the Platform or with the express written consent of the Uploader. Where you repost another user’s Content, or include another user’s Content in a playlist or station or where you listen to another user’s Content offline, you acquire no ownership rights whatsoever in that Content. Subject to the rights expressly granted in this section, all rights in Content are reserved to the relevant Uploader."

I would agree - always read the terms carefully. But also be sure to read them in full, and without stopping your reading of the terms before you've actually reached the end of the license being granted. It's the difference between "I want to kill everyone who tries to kill me" and "I want to kill everyone."
 
Oh, it’s the truth, Hasen6. You must not be an American. Ever tried to sue a huge US corporation for using one song on a network radio talk show? How would you do that it a way that didn’t cost money?
You file a copyright infringement claim. These things can bring a production down.

In this age of streaming it can get very messy if the distributor doesn't have all of his legal rudiments in order.

Early on in my career I had a lot of music stolen and never really knew my rights. Now I'm a lot more protective. It's important to know what you can do that doesn't cost a lot of money.

Don't be afraid of big corporations. They are just made up of a bunch of people that lay awake at night worried about their cushy jobs and mortgages. If somebody is using your music illegally in America or in the EU+Britain there's a lot you can do to threaten and get some money or get it removed before it goes to court which is the last thing anybody wants to do.

 
You file a copyright infringement claim. These things can bring a production down.

In this age of streaming it can get very messy if the distributor doesn't have all of his legal rudiments in order.

Early on in my career I had a lot of music stolen and never really knew my rights. Now I'm a lot more protective. It's important to know what you can do that doesn't cost a lot of money.

Don't be afraid of big corporations. They are just made up of a bunch of people that lay awake at night worried about their cushy jobs and mortgages. If somebody is using your music illegally in America or in the EU+Britain there's a lot you can do to threaten and get some money or get it removed before it goes to court which is the last thing anybody wants to do.

Oh, I didn’t like it, believe me. But I think this is more applicable, and more worth doing, in a production situation, i.e. a tv show or movie. This was more ephemeral - a radio talk show - and there was only one detection. My publisher ended up actually owning the copyright, and as far as I know they didn’t bother with it. Maybe they did send a cease and desist for all I know, which is what you’re talking about here. But no one is going to sue anyone or get any money out of this infringement. Maybe I’m too blasé? If it was a production situation, I think would feel differently.

Anyway, I’m much more protective now too. I think you can still get ripped off, but I try to make it harder.
 
Oh, it’s the truth, Hasen6. You must not be an American. Ever tried to sue a huge US corporation for using one song on a network radio talk show? How would you do that it a way that didn’t cost money?
A huge US corporation stole your music and you think you wouldn't have any course of action. That's ridiculous. Any lawyer would take your case if that were happening. Like José Herring said, there's a hell of a lot you can do regarding copyright especially in places like the US and Britain.
As for the other part... Emergent, developing countries always steal IP. The US certainly did. Wherever you’re from did too at some point.
US stole IP when they were developing? When exactly are you talking about here. Back so long ago when the UK and USA were still developing it would've been somewhat difficult to steal IP without the internet. Would be hard to even know what another country had come up with to be able to steal it. Sounds like “whataboutism” to me to me in any case.

I don’t know what your idea of China is but a country that is sending people to the moon does not need to steal IP, a country that is making super high budget Hollywood style movies does not need to steal IP, a country that is competing with the US in AI does not need to steal IP.

I suggest you keep politics out of this thread. I never stated China’s iP theft was justified or not, merely that it was happening and it is the country to be most wary of since they literally have laws to encourage it. Whereas for the rest of the world, your music is copyrighted as soon as you create it.
 
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Thank you for informing us. I've created Soundcloud account many many years ago and was unaware of this. Glad that the only tracks I have there are the ones I submitted for One Synth Challenge, hosted by KVR forum.
 
I started hosting on my own website - Soundcloud was actually stealing my clicks, taking users off my site and into their own rabbit hole. Yes, it has cost me some traffic as SC gives you great visibility; but they are parasitically profiting off the work of others. No one else has the playback features such as wave form and comments that they do, alas. But I need my traffic to stay on my site.
 
I started hosting on my own website - Soundcloud was actually stealing my clicks, taking users off my site and into their own rabbit hole. Yes, it has cost me some traffic as SC gives you great visibility; but they are parasitically profiting off the work of others. No one else has the playback features such as wave form and comments that they do, alas. But I need my traffic to stay on my site.
Waveform yes, comments no. I tried another service and used it on my website (links in footer) and very happy with it.

I was a little unsure about loosing the comments feature, but when I gave it a thought, that use case didn’t really make sense to me: I get feedback from collaborators via email or IM, and I don’t really want comments from strangers on my site. So I don’t miss it…
 
Waveform yes, comments no. I tried another service and used it on my website (links in footer) and very happy with it.

I was a little unsure about loosing the comments feature, but when I gave it a thought, that use case didn’t really make sense to me: I get feedback from collaborators via email or IM, and I don’t really want comments from strangers on my site. So I don’t miss it…
I like your site. What music player are you using? Looks and works great.

Screenshot 2023-12-20 at 9.13.21 AM.png
 
I started hosting on my own website - Soundcloud was actually stealing my clicks, taking users off my site and into their own rabbit hole. Yes, it has cost me some traffic as SC gives you great visibility; but they are parasitically profiting off the work of others. No one else has the playback features such as wave form and comments that they do, alas. But I need my traffic to stay on my site.
Do you need comments?
 
I like your site. What music player are you using? Looks and works great.

Screenshot 2023-12-20 at 9.13.21 AM.png
Thanks! I’m using Wavekit as player and I’m very happy with it. It’s just out of beta and will be opening up soon to the public for signups. The site is home grown (let me know if you’d like more details).

I can only repeat @Soundbed ’s advice - go to this thread to read more about Wavekit and to get access now: https://vi-control.net/community/th...-an-audio-hosting-service.106823/post-5462869
 
I didn;t see a signup or preview page - and no hint about pricing.
20 Euros per year for 10 hours of stored audio. 100 Euros per year 100 hours.

Send me a private message and I can hook you up. I kinda know the owner :grin:

I started hosting on my own website - Soundcloud was actually stealing my clicks, taking users off my site and into their own rabbit hole. Yes, it has cost me some traffic as SC gives you great visibility; but they are parasitically profiting off the work of others. No one else has the playback features such as wave form and comments that they do, alas. But I need my traffic to stay on my site.
You've basically described one of the major reasons I started building Wavekit. Their embedded player is basically an ad for SoundCloud and a privacy nightmare.
 
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